First Time? Sign Up or Login to your My Jobing Account
|
Arizona
Change Location
|
|
Home > Jobing Community Blogs > Blog Post: The Online Application S...
Blog Post: The Online Application System Ate My Resume
posted Wednesday, January 14, 2009 2:02 PM
My brother, who's searching for a job, recently complained to me about how employers make applying for jobs near impossible, thanks to the online application system. You have to create a username and password for every company you apply to and you have to upload your resume in the correct format and if you happen to accidentally press the ‘back’ button, you risk losing all the information you just entered. Even though I was defensive at first, I realize that I get many phone calls per day from candidates asking me if I received their resumes. Obviously, my brother is not the only one who gets frustrated from the whole online application process.
The correct term for the online application system is ‘applicant tracking system’ or ATS, but no matter what you call it, it can be quite frustrating dealing with it when you would rather just send your resume by mail or to someone’s e-mail address and just be done with it. The advantage of applicant tracking systems is that they are designed to make the recruiter or hiring manager’s jobs easier, but the disadvantage is that they can make it more difficult for you, the candidate, to get the job. They can include tons of questions that can screen you out if you don’t provide the correct answer. These questions range from topics such as salary requirements to specific technical questions. So, even after you have spent your time applying to the position and answering all the questions, you may have said something that caused you to be automatically screened out. Now the hiring manager doesn’t even see your application. I’m beginning to see why we get those frantic calls now. Here are some tips that will help prevent you from wanting to pull your hair out while applying for a job.
Community Comments
|
About This Author
About Me
HR / Recruitment Manager
Sheila Nazari Blog Archive
Knight Transportation, Inc. Jobs
Phoenix
Phoenix
Phoenix
Phoenix
Phoenix
Bookmark & Share This Page
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Perhaps thru EEOC and the Dept of Labor these useless pieces of garbage can get companies shut down as a result because of any possibilities of "glitches" which may create the air of discrimination and send some of these "HR"managers to the clink and punish them for discrimination or even the hint of it.
This practice is supposed to make the mountains of data more manageable for the employer, but in reality the best candidates are probably not identified. Does this seem like a loose-loose situation? The only one that seems to have an easier time with it all is the recruiter!
Sheila - your thoughts? Does this scenario happen that often?
I went as far as emailing snagajob and asked them specificaly why I was disqualified, and their only response was that the employer makes those decisions. I know for a fact that none of those companies even saw my application...the response on snag's website as instantanaeous. They also told me I had every right to go to the place in question and apply in person...which I have done. I explained the problem to Kohl's and was scheduled for an interview.
One thing I have noticed, is that each and every web site is geared to sign you up for college classes. Most do not require you to inquire about classes, but a couple demanded it...then dont show any jobs to search or apply for. Reminds me of a jobbing scam in Calif. a couple of decades ago...searching for 'actors'. Hundreds applied for the job and read a 'script' for a 'movie' but it was a scam to get you to buy a portfolio for thirty bucks from the 'interviewer' (who was actually an out-of-work photographerby the name of Oppenheimer...yeah, he claimed to be J.Robt's grandson!)
Although my strategy worked with Kohl's, I still dont know how to get an interview at Home Depo or Lowe's. Twice, I was mis-directed to Amazon.com and neither time was I allowed to fill out an application...to the tune of 6 gallons of wasted gas! The first time, no one knew anything about a job opening...much to the dismay of HUNDREDS of would-be applicants, and the second time we were given a bogus address by the web site.
To be quite honest, I wouldnt have this g--damn pc if it were'nt a gift...I'd still be in the dark and behind the times, but a lot happier. (ignorance is bliss)
Roland Fernandez, the actual net pay you get in AZ is higher than what you get in CA and many other states because AZ state tax is not a percentage of your gross pay. State tax on your wages is based on a percentage, i.e., 15% or higher as you choose, of what your federal tax is. Therefore, you are keeping more of your earnings.
I also hate this process of applying for jobs and liken it to a "dark hole" because you have absolutely no idea whether your application and resume has or will ever be considered. Actual experience, knowledge, abilities, integrity and value you may actually contribute to a company will most likely never be considered.
It is probably a waste of time applying to jobs that are offered by companies like "Company Confidential" and other agencies as well because they never respond on teh job you have applied for nor do they contact you for any other matches you might qualify for.
Press on and Good Luck to all of us!!!!
By the way, my favorite comment of everybody's was Scott Scot: "recruiters suck in general. Very unintelligent and consumed by their own self worth." So true, in general. Though there are a FEW good ones out there.
Sometimes I decide that an employer is not the right one for me because their recruiting system denies people a level of respect for their abilities. I consider their decision to use poor recruiting policies as a measure of their overall judgement in managing their company.
People are what makes companies live - companies need to get back in touch with people or they will continue to fail in their endeavors.
I guess I have had some better luck than some of you. I am getting one interview for about every twenty to twenty five I apply for. I’ve talked to a couple of the hiring managers and they tell me that they are getting 200 to 300 applications of which maybe 50 have all the qualifications for the job. And of that they only interview what they think are the top 5 or 10. Those are some hard numbers to swallow. 40 to 45 candidates who have all the qualifications are not even getting an interview. So even if the ATS did screen you out, odds are you still might get an interview.
What is the most frustrating to me is to apply for a job I feel I am perfect for, tailor my cover letter and resume to match the job spec, NEVER hear anything back after hitting submit.........AND THEN THE JOB IS REPOSTED A WEEK LATER!!!!! On top of that many places won't allow you to re-apply for the same position. I have been creating different accounts just to get around this. It is very frustrating to say the least.
Best of luck to everyone
I am not even out of a job (yet) but am always looking for a better scenario. A lot of job "postings" are only there to gather info on available people, not to actually hire anyone. That is why the ad keeps being run even though they do not even call you back.
I have gotten used to the fact that I will not hear from a company afyter sending in a resume or application. HR departments are screeners who have been told to cut costs by not responding to any except the ones that they are actually setting up interviews to see. Everyone else, forget about it.
Suggestion: all of you that have lots of years of experience - trim some of that out of your resume. Make yourself look younger. Take dates off of college degrees, etc. Never give a "required salary" up front - never. That is always negotiable later. Bet you'll get some calls then. Making yourself look like a cheap catch gets the HR screener's eye.
I am not even out of a job (yet) but am always looking for a better scenario. A lot of job "postings" are only there to gather info on available people, not to actually hire anyone. That is why the ad keeps being run even though they do not even call you back.
I have gotten used to the fact that I will not hear from a company afyter sending in a resume or application. HR departments are screeners who have been told to cut costs by not responding to any except the ones that they are actually setting up interviews to see. Everyone else, forget about it.
Suggestion: all of you that have lots of years of experience - trim some of that out of your resume. Make yourself look younger. Take dates off of college degrees, etc. Never give a "required salary" up front - never. That is always negotiable later. Bet you'll get some calls then. Making yourself look like a cheap catch gets the HR screener's eye.
I am not even out of a job (yet) but am always looking for a better scenario. A lot of job "postings" are only there to gather info on available people, not to actually hire anyone. That is why the ad keeps being run even though they do not even call you back.
I have gotten used to the fact that I will not hear from a company afyter sending in a resume or application. HR departments are screeners who have been told to cut costs by not responding to any except the ones that they are actually setting up interviews to see. Everyone else, forget about it.
Suggestion: all of you that have lots of years of experience - trim some of that out of your resume. Make yourself look younger. Take dates off of college degrees, etc. Never give a "required salary" up front - never. That is always negotiable later. Bet you'll get some calls then. Making yourself look like a cheap catch gets the HR screener's eye.
Obviously, as Ms. Nazari pointed out in her article, the comuter that sifts through the candidate's responses has certain lines of softwear code that effectively read: "If the candidate answers "No" to this question then we're not interested in him/her. Delete this person." I'm sure this IS an aid to those seeking qualified aplicants, and even helps an applicant avoid wasting time at an interview for a job s/he is not qualified for. HOWEVER...
Personally, I think it shouldn't be much of a problem to include a line of code that tells the examining computer something such as: "If the candidate answered "No" to this question (meaning that we're not interested in him/her and that his/her application has been deleted), then SEND AN AUTOMATED EMAIL, INFORMING THE APPLICANT OF THIS FACT." (Please note: In this case ALL CAPS are not my version of yelling, nor do they constitute a demonstration of anger. I was simply trying to find a way to highlight important information.)
I would like to point out that the ATS forms I filled out for Border's Books did bring a very nice response from a nearby branch of that company. Kudos to Border's Books!
Over all, however, I must say that I have found more luck replying to Craigs List advertisements. I did discover, however, that many employers are hesitant to use Craigs List because they feel (having endured some bad experiences in the past) that CL users tend not to be truly interested in taking the offered jobs. As one interviewer told me: "I think that a lot of people who answer CL adds are net-surfing at work, just looking around to see what's out there. When I reply, asking to set up an interview, the majority of applicants don't even respond. Of those who do, many will respond simply to tell me they were, in fact, 'just looking' sort of as if they were 'window shopping' for jobs."
I think this is something to consider when responding to CL adds. In fact, after that, I made it a habbit to drop a hard-copy of my resume at the business in question if that info was given.
Good luck to all in your job search. I hope you land a GREAT ONE...SOON!
First, look at the picture of Ms. Nazari and know that she is not going to pick a well-experienced person because you are not like her. Her history probably goes something like this, went to school and received her BAom OR MAOM, did her internship, joined SHRM, received her provate SHRM accediadation, did some grunt work as an HR assistant or Generalist, did some recruitng work, probably good with the smile and correct buss words to convince her employer she was the right person and has some other HR persons as good referecences, in an industry that has bvery defined parameters to which she does not have to take any risk.
Second, undestand that she presented on the frustations and no solutions with the system she is talking about.
Third, remember she is playing it safe because there is high turnover in HR and is not going to rock the boat. I have attended meetings for many HR persons out of work and the cut-throat stories in hiring, retaining and interviews rival many other jobs. By the way, most HR managers have a three year turnover.
Fourth, screening questions are there to screen you out and not in. They are based on psychological parameters. HR professionals see themselves as part of the behavioral sciences but have no formal training as such, not even PhDs.
Fifth, HR is the gatekeeper and most like to wield their power to shut it on whoever they choose. Sixth, you will never get an answer as to why you were not chosen because of liability.
Seventh, don't expect the DOL/EEOC to defend you, They are there primarily for class action suits where the offence is systemic (very cut and dried so as to be easy to present almost without question.) If you do want to pursue the matter, your complaint goes through the DOL and they will give you a "right-to-sue" if you pass their review process. DOL only processes about 60 cases per year in AZ. Age complaints have risen several hundred percent in the past several years. It will take a slew of complaints related to sites that ask for age criteria and or information related to gratduation dates for class-action proceedings to make a dent of attention by the DOL.
Eighth, most jobs are contracted from external recruiters. Employment agencies are nothing more than people traders for a fee. With rare exception in a few specialities, these recruiters do not know a thing about special job skills, same for in-house HR, and do exactly as they are told. There are no contractual time demands made for delivery and will set on a position for months to make sure they get the "exact match" to claim their $10Ks in fees. This is a near $100 Billion/year business.
Nineth, remember it is a numbers game. A long time ago, in the downturn of the early 1990s, an ADVO executive told me the return on mass mailing was about 1% to 2%. One year I put out about 500 resumes and cover letters, applications and came up with 5 to 7 interviews. Right in the target area.
Tenth, remeber that sites like this are from a marketing company, They spend a lot of money contracting with companies so they can have the priviledge to place jobs on thuis site. Jobing.com is not an employment agency it is part of a network that is connected to the Phoenix Chamber of Commerce and have paid lobbyists.
Finally, I have been there too. I was fortunate enough to find P/T work stacking boxes and was retained after the holidays. I hope this answers some of the questions the author did not. Best wishes and hope many find opportunities soon.
When I started in the telcom trade 14 years ago, you could build a reputation for yourself and when you needed a new job, you went around and TALKED to Ops Managers. Usually, I'd get a response like, "Oh, I've heard of you...when can you start?" Now, like everyone else on here, I can't even get past the online guardian. And I've been out of work long enough that I can't afford the gas to drive all over the valley dropping off apps. So, lately, I've been practicing the phrase, "You want fries with that?"
I feel that all of this schooling has been a MAJOR WASTE OF TIME. Fast food jobs - Sorry You Are OVER QUALIFIED! Someone needs to notify the BANKS the situation is CRITICAL! I am starting to believe that we older workers are being pasted over because of the money we can command in a good economy. Our years of service and experience should be rewarded.
As for the ATS system, this is a MAJOR MISTAKE! There is no substitute for Face-To-Face interviewing. What has happened to the OLD SYSTEM where we walked in and SPOKE TO A REAL PERSON? These automated telephone systems just add to the problem of not enough personal interaction.
I have been out of work since APRIL, I have heard so many times that I am overqualified that I can no longer keep track. I have sent THOUSANDS of resumes and have dumbed them down considerably, but the few interviews I have gotten it has been difficult to hide my experience and skills. I had one position down to 2 people, I lost it to someone that had 6 months experience in that particular area, I had too many diversified skills and years of experience in all of them. I am willing to take a major (70%) wage cut and do avoid previous salary questions if there are any way around them. However, I don't understand needing a degree for a $10 hour job. I didn't go to college, I worked my way up to President of the corporation. Forget a lateral move, I state my previous title as Executive Assistant, talk about a hit to your self esteem. So here I am 9 months later, still unemployed, homeless with a child that has been ill for 3 years now and 3 other children, credit went from 800's to 400's (have also lost opportunities because of current credit score) and the sole provider for my family. So when you get frustrated and think it can't get any worse, trust me it can.
If good help is hard to find, then good companies are even HARDER to find!
Jobing is just selling the "service" to employers, and is marketing it to job seekers as a means to reach employers electronically. Employers are looking to fill EEOC requirements by documenting it in the prescreening process, but the HR people have absolutely NO interest in looking at your resume. NONE. They are looking to find a quota of candidates, and they have no intention of looking at all the resumes. They did away with paper resumes and cover letters because they didn't want to read through all of it. They are doing the same with the on-line job sites.
I've also revised my resume a number of times, and have talked with the AZ job centers on how to present my resume. I was told to take off all employment dates because employers ARE descriminating.
I have to laugh. A few years ago I went to a FEDEX job fair. You were there because you were "invited". I had all of the qualifications for their inside sales job. But once they started the session we were told that your PAY was based on the amount of experience you had. Oddly enough I was the only one over 40 in that room. In fact, I ddiscovered that nearly every candidate that was "invited" was just graduating from college! A few days later, I received a rejection notice stating other candidates more qualified. What a JOKE! Every single person in that room hadn't even graduated yet, and if anything I was OVER qualified...but I was also going to be more expensive because of my experience. Oh well. Now that I know FEDEX's system, I don't even bother to send them a resume.
I did talk with a wonderful employment company that markets you. I have yet to get the money to use their service,..but I have to tell you they do have an interesting system. They market you to the decision maker, NOT the HR person. They told me that only about 10% of all jobs are on the job sites, and believe it after the number of times I've submitted my resume. They design a precreening on what you want to do, what your strengths are, etc. They guarantee to find you a job, and the final payment for their service is not collected until after you on the job for 6 months! If you do not like the job after 6 months, they start over, at no extra charge. They guarantee to get you a job. They have their stats, too, but I find that the way they stagger the payments, and the time they spend with you, it's much better than any head hunter, or job site. I realize their services are "free", but they have NO loyalty to you because you are not their revenue stream!